Pro-Life Radio with Andrew Shirvell, Florida Voice for the Unborn

Bruce Cherry: [00:00:00] Pro-Life Radio is a prerecorded program paid for by Pro-Life Radio. Preserving the sanctity of life in Florida, A loud voice for the unborn. This is Pro-Life Radio. With your hosts, Vicky and Bruce Cherry,

Bruce Cherry: and welcome to another edition of Pro-Life Radio Live from the John Barrows Memorial Studio here at Salem Radio in Orlando, Florida.

Bruce Cherry: It is Pro-Life Radio on a Sunday night across from me, my lovely wife, Vicky Cherry.

Vicky Cherry: Good evening

Bruce Cherry: and on. Uh, and I’m Bruce Cherry and our special guest tonight is Andrew Shirvell, uh, founder and executive director of Florida Voice for the Unborn. Andrew, welcome to the show. Well, thank you again for having me back on, uh, Bruce and uh, uh, Bruce and Vicky.

Bruce Cherry: Oh, you’re welcome. Thank you for being here with us. We appreciate that. We start everything off with Jeremiah one, five and prayer.

Vicky Cherry: Before I formed you in the womb, I knew you before you were born. I sanctified you. [00:01:00] I ordained you a prophet to the nations

Bruce Cherry: Heavenly Father. Thank you for another opportunity to come together and share truth to those who will hear it.

Bruce Cherry: God, we pray that we help open eyes and that all come to know just how precious the unborn is are. And uh, that. We come to know that not one of us has a right to end a life that you have ordained. We pray for your blessings upon Andrew and upon Florida voice for the unborn. And we pray that if there’s someone out there tonight that’s not sure that that may find themselves pregnant and is not sure what they’re going to do, we pray that we can help change their minds, that we can educate them by sharing truth, and we pray for your blessings upon all who hear this show tonight.

Bruce Cherry: In Jesus name we pray. Amen. Amen. Andrew, welcome to the show. Thank you for being here with us again. We’ve had Andrew on a few times, uh, Florida Voice for the Unborn Great organization out of Tallahassee. Andrew, you by training are a lawyer, correct? [00:02:00]

Andrew Shirvell: Well, yes, I have a JD from VE Maria School of Law, which is now located in Naples, right here in the Sunshine State.

Andrew Shirvell: Of course, I obtained my JD when VE Maria was in Ann Arbor, Michigan, and I believe it’s the only law school that’s ever relocated across the the country entirely. Oh,

Bruce Cherry: well, I, I think if things keep going the way they’re going to New York, they might have a few more, but, uh, I, I can’t say for certain, but that’s one thing’s happening.

Bruce Cherry: I know there’s a lot of folks that are getting out of, out of New York, and that’s a whole nother show that we’ll talk about at another time. But, uh, so because you have your Juris Doctorate and because of what you guys do, uh, at Florida Voice for the Unborn, you, you’re, you’re very tuned in, in Tallahassee.

Bruce Cherry: What’s going on up there with the next session? What can we expect?

Andrew Shirvell: Well, yes, I, I am a registered, uh, state lobbyist, and I know that’s a dirty word, but in this context it’s actually very good because Florida voice for the unborn only focuses [00:03:00] on issues that impact our unborn brothers and sisters. So we don’t deal with the wide spectrum of other pro-life issues.

Andrew Shirvell: We deal with what we feel is the most preeminent. A concern out there, which is the unfortunate continued killing of the unborn here in Florida. And I’m entering now my seventh legislative session as a, as a lobbyist. So in 2026, because it is an even year. The, you know, 2026, the six, uh, being even mm-hmm.

Andrew Shirvell: Under the Florida Constitution. The, uh, annual 60 day legislative session begins in January and ends in early March. So for 2026, uh, the session will start, uh, in Tallahassee on January 13th and conclude on March 13th. And, um, we at Florida Voice for the unborn are anticipating, uh, another. [00:04:00] How could I put this charitably difficult legislative session, just like we saw in 2025?

Andrew Shirvell: Uh, now, don’t get me wrong. In 2025, and I think we’ve discussed this before on one of your prior, um, shows, but we did have a significant victory with, uh, reforming the way that. Proposed amendments to the state constitution. Mm-hmm. Yes. Can be, can be, um, enacted. So that, that was a huge victory, legislative wise.

Andrew Shirvell: Mm-hmm. But entering 2026, because we’re gonna go into an election year with, um, and with all due respect to our pro-life governor, governor DeSantis, he is a la duck under the Florida Constitution. He cannot run for a third consecutive term, so he, he is entering his final year. And because there’s a lot of leftover, uh, contentiousness, uh, between the Republican legislative leadership and the legislative body itself and the governor and his office, [00:05:00] I really don’t expect.

Andrew Shirvell: Much, um, in terms of beneficial legislation for our unborn brothers and sisters to be, um, uh, actually getting over the finish line. So I know that’s kind of like a hard reality check, but from my perspective in being here, uh, uh, you know, like I said, for this is gonna be my seventh legislative session.

Andrew Shirvell: The last one was by far the, the, the most acrimonious one I’ve ever experienced. Uh, but you know, God works in mysterious ways. We’ve still got a significant victory out of that, despite all the turmoil. So we always have to be on our toes and prepared, and that’s what we’re, we’re entering to do now in the final two months before, uh, the 2026 legislative session starts because we’re, we’re actually in what we call.

Andrew Shirvell: Pre legislative session committee weeks, so there’s six of them scheduled. Um, uh, leading up to the actual start of the session. And they all occur at the end, at the end of 2025 here. So we’ve already [00:06:00] gone through three of them and we have three more to go. And, uh, we did see, uh, a, um, uh, a bill introduced, uh, uh, last month.

Andrew Shirvell: Uh, and then also, um, actually it was also at the very end of, uh, last month as well, a house companion version, but both in the Senate and the House. Uh, a bill that would allow parents to recover civil damages. If their unborn child is wrongfully, uh, killed, uh, by a, a third party, whether it’s an intentional wrongdoing act or a negligent act, uh, something that is currently not allowed under Florida law, uh, because civilly and civil court unborn children are not considered, uh, victims, which to me is outrageous because they are just as much persons as you and I and they are considered actually.

Andrew Shirvell: Victims under, uh, Florida’s, uh, criminal law, so to to have parity with our civil law and our criminal law, if that makes sense. [00:07:00] This legislation has been reintroduced for the 2026 session and is already under consideration. By, uh, bolt chambers now in the pre legislative, um, session committee weeks. So that, that’s a good thing.

Andrew Shirvell: Uh, but this is also the third attempt, the third consecutive attempt to get this legislation, uh, passed through our super majority. A pro-life Republican legislature, so nothing is ever easy. Uh, I, I, I have my doubts whether this was going to, to get over the finish line, but at Florida Voice for the unborn and our grassroots supporters, we’re already pushing and lobbying for this, um, this worthwhile life-affirming legislation.

Andrew Shirvell: So we have to be in it to win it. So I don’t wanna be a downer. And I don’t, you know, I don’t wanna sound all gloom and doom, but we do have to be realistic. Mm-hmm. But again, God can work miracles. We just have to be part of that process.

Vicky Cherry: And Andrew, what do you think has been the holdup with this bill? Is there a specific thing that you can point out?[00:08:00]

Andrew Shirvell: Yes. You know, a, a lot of people at first, when this was first introduced in, uh, 2024, thought it had to do with, uh, more of, uh, the abortion industry who, you know, they, they hate any legislation that. Even remotely acknowledges the humanity of an unborn child, because of course that undercuts their, their business and their arguments, uh, that, you know, unborn children are not persons and they’re just blobs of tissue.

Andrew Shirvell: But what we’ve seen is that rather than this be, uh, a solely a pro-life versus pro-abortion debate over this legislation, what has developed and what I’ve learned is that really the big hold up is. The Florida abortion, uh, excuse me, the Florida insurance industry is the main opponent to this bill, and we’re, this is part of a much larger fight that really doesn’t concern, uh, pro-life advocates such as myself, but it’s part of a much larger fight, uh, [00:09:00] philosophical fight between the legislature, different factions in the legislature, the governor’s office having to do with.

Andrew Shirvell: The, uh, the insurance industry and also, uh, whether we are going to expand, I guess, the right to sue, not only, you know, on behalf of unborn children, but in other areas of the law. Uh, it kind of gets very nuanced and I don’t want to go into all the details because I know we’re focused specifically, uh, on the unborn.

Andrew Shirvell: Mm-hmm. But it’s part of a much larger fight, so mm-hmm. This is where we’re lined up. We’re actually lined up as pro-life advocates with the trial lawyers. Who wanna see this bill passed and the abortion industry is lined up with the insurance industry. Who wants to, uh, stop this bill by any means? So, you know, when they say politics, uh, makes strange bedfellows.

Andrew Shirvell: This is certainly a little bit strange to us. Uh, but we’ve gotta do what we gotta do. And, and to me this is a no brainer. It’s a life affirming bill.

Vicky Cherry: You know, and it’s funny ’cause insurance was originally [00:10:00] designed to protect us. Mm-hmm. And it seems like it is completely going against that. Another point I wanted to make about what you said is obviously, clearly the Bible supports this.

Vicky Cherry: It even talks about if a woman’s baby in the womb is injured.

Group: Mm-hmm. Yes it does. You know,

Vicky Cherry: so if you’re wondering, is this biblical or not? Read your Bible. Yes it is. We should be protecting those lives, those unborn preborn.

Bruce Cherry: And I know I should know where it is in scripture, and by the time we come back from our break, I will have it for you.

Bruce Cherry: But yeah, it, it does talk about if you, if you. If through negligence or whatever, um, you cause a woman to lose her baby or cause injury to the baby, you must make restitution. So even the, you know, the Bible says the baby’s a baby. The baby’s alive inside the womb, the baby’s a baby. Uh, Andrew, so your organization exists off of donations, does it not?

Andrew Shirvell: We are only solely supported by our grassroots supporters. [00:11:00] And, uh, you know, we are, we’re a true, authentic, uh, movement. There’s no big hand behind this organization. We are the product of all the little people, if you want to call us little mm-hmm. Who care so diligently for our unborn brothers and sisters.

Bruce Cherry: So how can folks who are listening to the show donate to your, to your organization?

Andrew Shirvell: Well, if you’d like to support us financially or otherwise by volunteering, I would urge everybody to go to Florida Voice for the Unborn all one word.com. And there you can, um, you make a contribution, uh, and, uh, also you can sign up to be a volunteer.

Andrew Shirvell: We, we are looking for, uh, specific volunteers, uh, I would say closer to the Tallahassee area, even though we are as. Statewide, uh, group with supporters in every corner of this, uh, beautiful, uh, state. But we need people, uh, especially to come to the committee hearings, to [00:12:00] testify in favor of good pro-life legislation like the bill I just talked about, and then also to oppose, uh, any bad, um, a legislation that harms our unborn brothers and sisters.

Andrew Shirvell: And there’s always. Bad legislation proposed. And so we have to make sure we’re, we’re lobbying as well against, uh, against the bad stuff. Because the moment we look away is the moment, uh, it starts to get a attraction there with people becoming complacent. So it’s very important to have ordinary pro-life citizens in Tallahassee at these legislative hearings, um, testifying.

Andrew Shirvell: Uh, uh, on uh, on behalf of the good legislation and against the bad legislation.

Bruce Cherry: Alright, well, coming back, we’ll tell you how you can get in touch with Florida Voice for the unborn, but right now we’ve got a break. We’ve got Andrew Cheval, founder and director of Florida Voice for the unborn on Pro-Life Radio on a Sunday night.

Bruce Cherry: Thank you for listening. We’ll be right back with more Pro-Life Radio on AM nine 50 FM 94.9. The [00:13:00] answer.

Bruce Cherry: Okay. All right, Andrew, we’ll be, we’re gonna come right back here and, uh, I’m gonna share that scripture piece. Uh, Exodus 21, verses 22 through 25.

Andrew Shirvell: Okay.

Vicky Cherry: Then at some point I wanna ask you, um, what you feel are a few of the most effective practices that we can do as everyday citizens to abolish abortion.

Andrew Shirvell: Okay. Okay.

Bruce Cherry: And, uh, and we want to get the, um, so you talked about the donations. Uh, I’m gonna ask you really quickly. What the address is to donate or just what we just send ’em to your website, Florida voice for the unborn.com

Andrew Shirvell: to

Vicky Cherry: volunteer.

Andrew Shirvell: Right. It’s, [00:14:00] there’s a donation page linked on the homepage, and there’s also, it’s right under the, at the very end of the homepage, so. Gotcha. Just, just in general for the, for the site in general, because people have to become familiar with the group if they, you know, want to participate with us financially.

Vicky Cherry: And do, do, is that where they would go for if they wanna volunteer?

Andrew Shirvell: Oh, yeah, absolutely. We have a separate own volunteer, uh, webpage, and we also have a monthly non-denominational Christian, uh, prayer, uh, service online that, uh, we conduct sometimes with special guests as well.

Group: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. And

Andrew Shirvell: so we do that every month, uh, too.

Andrew Shirvell: So we, we are always doing variety of, uh, actions, prayer and action.

Bruce Cherry: Okay. All right. All right. Okay, Pete, let’s, uh, let’s jump back. Vicky, you’re gonna bring us back and I’ll do the. Alright, I’ll do the Exodus. Okay. Alright, here we go. In 3, 2, 1.

Vicky Cherry: And welcome back to Pro-Life Radio on a Sunday evening. I’m Dickie Cherry. Across from me is my handsome [00:15:00] husband, Bruce. And online with us we have Andrew from Florida’s voice for the Unborn. We’re so good and glad that you are back with us tonight.

Bruce Cherry: Yeah. And, and as I, as I promised before we went to break, when we were talking about, uh, it’s biblical mm-hmm.

Bruce Cherry: That if you cause injury to a baby, and Andrew was talking about the bill, um. Uh, for, to recover civil, civil damages mm-hmm. Parents could recover civil damages in the death of their unborn or the injury of their unborn child due to accident or negligence. Um, it is biblical Exodus 21 versus 22 through 25 if men fight and hurt a woman with child so that the child, she gives birth prematurely.

Bruce Cherry: Yet no harm follows. He shall surely be punished accordingly as the woman’s husband imposes on him, and he shall pay as the judges determine. But if any harm follows, then you shall give life for life. Eye for eye. Tooth for tooth. Hand for hand. Foot for foot. [00:16:00] Burn for burn. Wound for wound stripe, for stripe.

Vicky Cherry: Yeah. Pretty crazy.

Bruce Cherry: Yeah. And that’s the, that’s the, uh, new King James version. There’s other versions that talk about financial in, in that realm of financial restitution. So, uh, there we go. Alright, uh uh, Andrew Shirvell, founder and executive director for Florida Voice for the Unborn, and we were talking about donations.

Bruce Cherry: Uh, to keep that, that ministry going, that organization going, that grassroots organization and, and you know, they’re lobbyist and Andrew, you were talking about, that’s, that’s a bad word. Well, it, it’s, it’s, it’s only a bad word if they’re on the other side of the aisle from what, right. You know, it, it’s like, uh, and I, and Andrew, I hate to, to give this analogy, but like it, a lot of people don’t like lawyers until you need one.

Bruce Cherry: You know, so that’s right. So, you know, all lawyers are bad except for your lawyer, you know, that, that, that kind of thing. So in order to donate and to support Florida voice for the unborn, and we urge you to do this, visit their website, Florida Voice for the [00:17:00] unborn.com. Again, that’s Florida voice For the unborn.com visit the website.

Bruce Cherry: You can donate, you can volunteer, and it’s, it’s a great site to go and just learn more about what’s going on. If you’re, if you have questions about what’s happening in the pro-life movement in Florida, you’re gonna find your answers there.

Vicky Cherry: Mm-hmm.

Bruce Cherry: That’s for sure.

Vicky Cherry: That’s why we love to have Andrew on. He is a wealth of knowledge.

Bruce Cherry: Yes, he is. So we were talking about the bill and, um, and the, the upcoming legislative session. What other things can we take away from this, this session that’s coming up because I know you’re gonna be very busy.

Andrew Shirvell: Yes. It’s always a, it’s always a crazy time, uh, Bruce, uh, during the legislative session because it’s very fast paced.

Andrew Shirvell: Uh, actually, uh, you know, to get back to the civil liability for the wrongful death of an unborn child legislation, uh, I just wanted to bring your, your re uh, your listeners, excuse me, up to speed. Um, [00:18:00] it, it, it, both bills have been filed in each chamber of the legislature, so that’s a very good sign because in order for.

Andrew Shirvell: The legislation to, to really move forward in any one of the chambers. They have to be the, the legislation has to be filed in both of the chambers, so that, that’s good. It has sponsors in both. We’ve already had a senate, um, hearing in its first committee in, in the upper chamber. And that was on, um, November 4th election day and I was there.

Andrew Shirvell: And so were members of Florida Voice for the unborn, what we call our rapid deployment force to, uh, to talk about the bill testify during public testimony. Uh. Um, uh, and, uh, you know, one thing is at Florida with for the Unborn is that we’re, we’re just never a rubber stamp. Uh, we look at the legislation very carefully and if there are improvements or tweaks that we wanna make even to build that we support, we are aggressive in promoting those, uh, uh, improvements or [00:19:00] amendments.

Andrew Shirvell: And in the case of, of this, uh, civil liability legislation, we do see some room for improvement. And, uh, the first ch there’s two changes specifically we would like to see enacted by our good pro-life, uh, super majority legislature. First, we’d like to see this, uh, the legislation amended so that the definition that’s con, uh, contained within the bill that, uh, talks about unborn child or unborn children, that that definition is broadened.

Andrew Shirvell: That all unborn children are included in the definition right now. The bills language limits it to unborn children carried in the womb at any stage of development. Now that that, don’t get me wrong, that is a good definition, and that’s currently in Florida law regarding our criminal statute. But if you look at all these.

Andrew Shirvell: Embryos that have been created and [00:20:00] stored as a result of, uh, assisted reproductive technology, such as in vitro fertilization. We’re talking about tens of thousands. If not some have estimated as high as a hundred thousand human embryos that are frozen here in Florida that are stored. Um, you know, right now under this legislation, if something happens to them as a result of a third party’s wrongful act, say the.

Andrew Shirvell: The freezer goes out or somebody goes in there and intentionally destroys the embryos. There’s no way, even under this new legislation for parents to sue for damages, uh, because they’re not, these embryos wouldn’t be considered unborn children under this, under this, um, uh, amendment because it states in the womb to the wrongful debt statute.

Andrew Shirvell: So that, that has to be changed. It really has to be changed because we’re, we’re not talking about just a small number. Embryos. I mean, a person is a person whether they’re carried in the womb or they’re stored in the freezer. The, the, the [00:21:00] second, um, change. The second and final change we’d like to see made is that right now there’s, um, a carve out in both versions of the bill, uh, for, uh, medical providers or healthcare providers of each chamber currently uses two different definitions, but it doesn’t really matter because what they’re getting at.

Andrew Shirvell: Is that if you are in the abortion industry or if you’re in the IVF and related industries, you are specifically excluded, uh, from being, uh, sued under this statute unless the parents can. Can go and prove something extraordinary, uh, outside of the realm of what they consider reasonable, um, you know, medical care.

Andrew Shirvell: But what you know, what happens is when you start naming specific exceptions in a a statute, at the beginning of a lawsuit, a judge will look. Say parents bring the lawsuit against an abortionist anyway, and they say, you look, you committed an [00:22:00] abortion past six weeks and now I’m suing you for wrongful death.

Andrew Shirvell: And I didn’t really want it. It was a coerced and, um, the, the parents now have a higher threshold because. The healthcare provider, which unfortunately abortionists are still considered under Florida law mm-hmm. Are named specifically in the statute. And so the judge will say, look, you have to prove, and you have to show this in your initial pleadings, and it allows the abortionist to move to dismiss the lawsuit at a very early stage.

Andrew Shirvell: So you, the parents are not gonna get justice. Uh, you a lot of times you have to be able to get the lawsuit going to other further stages so you can, uh, depose. Abortionist, you can subpoena records and you can really get the evidence you need to, to prove your claims. So that’s, that’s our concerns with this.

Andrew Shirvell: It really has to do with the parents’ rights and, and treating really everybody equally under the law. As one of our, our, our members of our rapid deployment force testified, uh, on November, uh, fourth, [00:23:00] he said, look, it’s about quality. We want all unborn children treated equally, and we want all. Um, healthcare pro providers, all third parties that are potentially negligent, whether.

Andrew Shirvell: The wrongdoing happens because of a car crash or happens in the hospital. We want all the parties to be treated equally. So you can’t start picking, uh, winners and losers in the text to appease certain industries. And you know what, uh, Bruce and uh, Vicky, those people are never appeased anyway. So why bother?

Andrew Shirvell: That’s what I always say. Why bother? They’re never happy and they, they oppose the bill anyway. So there are, there’s room for improvement and we’re advocating for those changes. Um, but we have a duty to do that. But regardless, the intent of the bill is very, is very good, and we do support it, but it, it can be strengthened significantly with those, uh, proposed changes.

Bruce Cherry: Mm. Really quickly. Because you’re in Tallahassee, you’re, you’re. [00:24:00] Always dealing with the legislature. We hear from time to time there’s another amendment four coming. Then we’ll hear, no, it’s not coming. Then we’ll hear, oh no, there’s gonna be another amendment four. What can you tell us on that?

Andrew Shirvell: I honestly believe there is no, um.

Andrew Shirvell: Amendment four type, uh, proposal, uh, coming in the near future. And that is because our reforms that we enacted through the legislature, uh, in the 2025 session, which did not need voter approval, they were just statutory changes that were immediately signed into law by the governor. They have survived thus far.

Andrew Shirvell: Any court challenges. So we’re now about seven months removed from when they were passed into law. They’ve survived all court challenges and, uh, any remaining lawsuits or activity from, you know, the, the abortion industry and its allies, I would call it at this point. They’re allies. They all work together on the left.

Andrew Shirvell: Um, they, they have [00:25:00] been beaten back so much that. It looks to me like, um, this new, uh, change, these new changes are here to stay, and the changes are so significant. They are so significant as we’ve gone over in in prior shows that it, it, it’s almost a near impossibility for the abortion industry to revise under these new rules, uh, new statutory changes to revive, uh, an amendment.

Andrew Shirvell: Four type proposal. So I, it it’s definitely not gonna happen for 2026 because they would need close to a million signatures still, even under the old rules by February 1st, 2026. They haven’t even introduced a proposal now for 2028. Could they start going on that in 2026? They might. I’m not saying that they won’t.

Andrew Shirvell: I, I’m, I’m, I’m, what I am saying and what I am telling a pro-life, uh, grassroots advocates is that. The likelihood of them succeeding and getting it on the ballot. Uh, like they did in [00:26:00] 2024 is next to, um, uh, impossible. It really is. Uh, and so we, we have to, as a pro-life movement, we have to start looking forward about how we move the ball instead of being held captive to what might or might not happen.

Andrew Shirvell: I think we’ve taken care of that, uh, at least for the foreseeable future. Now we have to be, now we have to start going on the offense again instead of rather being held hostage by what, um, the abortion industry may or may not do.

Bruce Cherry: Alright. That’s, well that’s, that’s good news. It is good news. If it’s the case, that’s, that’s good news.

Bruce Cherry: But a question

Vicky Cherry: for you when we come back is, we’re up against a break. Then what will they do?

Bruce Cherry: Good question. More Pro-Life Radio. Coming up in just a bit. Andrew Shirvell, founder and director of the Florida Voice for the Unborn is on with us and we are coming to you from the John Barrows Memorial Studio Pro-Life Radio.

Bruce Cherry: More coming up on AM nine 50 FM 94.9. The answer.[00:27:00]

Bruce Cherry: Okay.

Vicky Cherry: All right.

Bruce Cherry: Wow. All

Vicky Cherry: this is the last one already, huh?

Bruce Cherry: No, this is three. Oh, segment three. Oh, okay. So you, you’re off today. Last week off. Today was me today. It’s today’s you.

Vicky Cherry: I am off today.

Bruce Cherry: Okay. Andrew, is there anything we’re missing that we should be, uh, addressing?

Andrew Shirvell: If, if you have a little bit of time, I’d like to talk about, um, the enforcement, about the heartbeat bill.

Bruce Cherry: Okay. And

Andrew Shirvell: concerns that grassroots pro-life advocates have with um, what’s going on in terms of enforcement.

Bruce Cherry: Okay. Alright.

Bruce Cherry: Will do all. When we come, we’re gonna jump back here. I’m gonna, I’m gonna let Vicky ask her question, what will the pro-Choice movement do? And so Andrew, we’re gonna look to you for an answer to that. [00:28:00] And, uh, then, uh, we’ll address the heartbeat bill that you were, um, you were talking about just now.

Andrew Shirvell: Okay.

Bruce Cherry: Okay.

Bruce Cherry: Challenges. Okay. Alright, Pete, we are ready in 3, 2, 1. And we’re back on a Sunday night Pro-Life Radio. Andrew Shirvell is our guest. He’s founder and director of Florida Voice for the Unborn. We’re hearing in the John Barrow’s Memorial Studio across from me, my lovely wife, Vicky Cherry. I’m Bruce Cherry.

Bruce Cherry: And Vicky had a question in the, in the radio business, we call that the hook. And so if you would please share that question again.

Vicky Cherry: Okay. So Andrew, you said that we. Probably will not have to battle an another like Amendment four. So I’m wondering what do you think that the [00:29:00] pro-choice, pro-death people are gonna bring up?

Vicky Cherry: What are they gonna do?

Bruce Cherry: Because we know they’re not gonna go away. Yeah.

Vicky Cherry: They’re just not gonna stop.

Andrew Shirvell: Right. That’s, that’s absolutely correct. They, they never give up and, uh, we cannot remain complacent. I think what they are going to do, and what we’ve seen unfortunately, is that they are going to continue to skirt Florida’s abortion laws, existing laws that we have on the books in order to.

Andrew Shirvell: Produce as many abortions as possible because that’s how they make their money. Mm-hmm. And so, uh, you know, the, they always say the sky is falling. And, uh, their big argument against, uh, Florida’s heartbeat, uh, law, which took effect finally on May. First 2024 after, um, you know, about a month, a year, uh, a year and a half of litigation over the, the previous 15 week abortion ban.

Andrew Shirvell: Mm-hmm. Uh, when they spoke about the heartbeat law, they said most women don’t know they’re [00:30:00] pregnant before six weeks. So there’s, you know, it’s impossible and. But of course we know that’s a huge lie because the number of abortions that continue to be reported since May 1st, 2024 continue to be in the tens of thousands here in Florida.

Andrew Shirvell: And so women are getting abortions. Um, they may not be getting the surgical abortions that they they got in the past except for the limited circumstances, the exceptions to the heartbeat law. But they are certainly legally taking the abortion pill. Uh, and committing abortion that way. Of course, under Florida law, they legally have to be, uh, prescribed and dispensed in person by a, a licensed mm-hmm.

Andrew Shirvell: Uh, physician. Uh, but, uh, that doesn’t even talk about the illegal black pill, uh, market, uh, that, uh, uh, excuse me, black market. Um, that are being shipped across, uh, Florida, uh, you know, from other states.

Group: Right? But we

Andrew Shirvell: know in terms of the legal accounting, what they’re [00:31:00] doing, the reporting every month, uh, their abortion statistics, uh, I hate to use that term because these are precious, uh, lives that are being snuffed out.

Andrew Shirvell: On a daily basis. But, uh, that, that’s, unfortunately, that’s how the state keeps track of it. It’s a, it’s a cold calculated number, you know, and, and that’s part of the problem, and it’s still being regulated as healthcare. Mm-hmm. So with the Agency for Healthcare Administration, they’re tasked with. Um, uh, keeping track or regulating the abortionist, enforcing Florida’s, uh, statutory, uh, uh, regulations on abortion.

Andrew Shirvell: And, uh, what we’ve seen is, uh, uh, to my knowledge, no. Abortion facility in the state of Florida has closed as a result of our new heartbeat law, which is very concerning because we’ve seen in other states, like Georgia mm-hmm. Where they have their, uh, heartbeat law come into effect. We saw closures, so that that’s the first indicator that there’s something not right going on.[00:32:00]

Andrew Shirvell: The second indicator is that many pro-life, um. Advocates believe that the numbers have not, so far, have not fallen the way they should have. Mm-hmm. Uh, due to, uh, the six week cutoff. And so that, that’s kind of a little bit complicated and it’s, it’s also complicated by the fact that we have yet to compare a full year, uh, which the last full year, uh, with, um, uh, where the 15 week ban was in effect, but no heartbeat law.

Andrew Shirvell: Was 2023 from January of 2023 through December of 2023, and then the Harpy law took place, you know, going into effect in the middle of 2024. So the numbers are a little, you know, outta whack. You really can’t compare them. It’s har, I, I say you can’t, it’s harder to compare them to 20, 23 numbers, but we’re waiting really for 2020 fives numbers because from January of 2025 through December of 2025, we will see a.

Andrew Shirvell: Full calendar year. And that’s the way [00:33:00] the Agency for Healthcare Administration really keeps track of these numbers, uh, with the heartbeat law being in effect. And so then we can compare 2020 three’s numbers to 2025 numbers full, full on comparison about taking into effect other things that happen in 2024.

Andrew Shirvell: Uh, and then we will see, I think we will have a much better, um, picture as to what’s taking place with, uh, the, the actual reductions. In abortions as a result of our, our heartbeat uh, law. But regardless, when we get to that stage, those final numbers for 2025 won’t be released till about maybe February or March of 2026.

Andrew Shirvell: Regardless, we know as a grassroots pro-life movement, um, just based on the 2024 numbers since May, and then some of the numbers that have been already reported in 2025, something is wrong. Something is ask skew with those numbers and, and there is. Large. Um, a large [00:34:00] suspicion that the abortion industry is, uh, continuing to do, um, many abortions past that six week cutoff.

Andrew Shirvell: Okay. Yeah, because that is odd. So that’s something we need to investigate

Vicky Cherry: because I just read, um, I think it was this morning, I don’t know if I think officially November 1st, the Manhattan, which was the Flagshift Clinic, they called it the Margaret Sanger. Right. It closed. So it’s, it’s no longer an operation.

Vicky Cherry: And we are not seeing that in Florida. Right. We’re not seeing these clinics shutting down. Well,

Bruce Cherry: we’ve seen a couple shut down, but it’s, it’s nothing to celebrate. Yes. It means babies aren’t gonna be torn apart limb from limb inside the womb. Mm-hmm. But what they’ve done is they’ve shifted over to the pill.

Bruce Cherry: Right. And so we’re seeing some clinics shut down. We are seeing a few. Uh, and that came about because of the defunding of Planned Parenthood and the hundreds of millions of dollars they lost. It wasn’t enough. Um, but there’s still, people are still [00:35:00] getting the pill.

Vicky Cherry: But what Andrew’s also saying is, we’re not seeing the clinic shutting down in Florida like we should.

Vicky Cherry: Right.

Andrew Shirvell: Yes, we’ve, we’ve seen a few shutdown down, but they, they weren’t actually performing abortions.

Group: Mm-hmm.

Andrew Shirvell: So I, I think we saw a Planned Parenthood closed recently in Fort Lauderdale. Uh, but apparently they hadn’t been doing abortions for a long time anyway. Mm-hmm. And so, and, and, and don’t get me wrong, anytime we can shut down, right.

Andrew Shirvell: Uh, uh, business associated with the abortion industry, that is something, uh. That is a victory. Mm-hmm. But we, we, in order to make a, um, a, a much larger dent in these, uh, horrible abortion numbers, we need a significant number of closures in the Sunshine State. And we just haven’t seen that yet. And so we, we’ve gotta continue to work towards that day when every single brick and mortar abortion mill in our state is closed permanently.

Vicky Cherry: Amen.

Bruce Cherry: You know, um. I was [00:36:00] talking a few weeks ago on the show about Lubbock, Texas, where the city and the county of Lubbock has become a sanctuary, pre-born sanctuary.

Group: Yeah.

Bruce Cherry: No abortion clinics are allowed in the inside the city or county limits. No abortions are performed inside the city or county limits, at least not legally.

Bruce Cherry: Um, and it’s set up in such a way that if a doctor is caught doing abortions, they can be criminally charged. Lose their licenses and their freedom. And I long to see that happen, start taking place in counties in Florida, if the legislature’s not gonna do it for us, if our governor’s not gonna do it for us.

Bruce Cherry: And I’m not, I’m not throwing Ron DeSantis under the bus at all. I mean, I, I love him. I think he’s a great governor, but we as citizens can do it by making sure that we put the right people in place to make sure that our counties. Sanctuary counties. You’ve got these places where they become sanctuary cities and sanctuary counties for, [00:37:00] um, non-documented immigrants.

Vicky Cherry: Illegal

Bruce Cherry: illegal immigrants. Why aren’t we doing this for our unborn children?

Vicky Cherry: Mm-hmm.

Bruce Cherry: Why aren’t we, and that, I mean, that’s just, well. Go ahead, Andrew.

Andrew Shirvell: Well, well, you know, Bruce, uh, you know, here in Florida we have another hurdle to overcome, which is that, uh, it, you know, in Florida, the state has, um, long had, uh, what is called, uh, preemptive regulatory ability over abortion mills.

Andrew Shirvell: So the, the power to, to prohibit abortion. Stop abortion, uh, lies explicitly with, uh, the state legislature and all efforts at the county or city level have been unsuccessful, uh, because of previous, um, interpretations regarding this, uh, preemption, if you will. It’s kind of another esoteric legal doctrine that I don’t need to get.

Andrew Shirvell: Too much into the weeds [00:38:00] over, but it’s another hurdle that we face here in Florida. That’s why we don’t see any cities or counties having the ability right now to, uh, to do, uh, what they’ve done in Texas and, and some of these other states with these local ordinances, but more, you know, I know Lubbock did do that.

Andrew Shirvell: Uh, but you know, the, the, the overarching theme is though in Texas, their state legislature not only passed their heartbeat law, which was novel. Uh, at the time because it allowed, uh, citizens to bring private rights of actions against those who cooperated with abortion. Mm-hmm. Uh, but it, they also superseded their own heartbeat law and had a trigger law that outlawed all abortions from the moment of conception, which took place.

Andrew Shirvell: Went into effect 60 days after the fall of Roe versus Wade. So, uh, that went into effect in August of, uh, 2022. So they, they really have a lot of their state law on their side. And so the county ordinances and the, the, the city ordinances in Texas at [00:39:00] this point, to me, as somebody who, uh, has legal training and a practice law for a number of years in a different state, to me they are, they are added protections to the unborn.

Andrew Shirvell: Mm-hmm. But they are not necessarily. They’re not necessarily needed in Texas now. They, they’re definitely probably needed here in Florida because our state legislature has not gone all the way like the, the Texas legislature has done. But again, there are different hurdles here under our laws that we have to overcome.

Andrew Shirvell: Mm-hmm. And, and, and one of the big things is that. We have people now that you know, that are pro-life and that are meaning, you know, meaning, meaning well like governor DeSantis, but are that are adamantly opposed to expanding the right of um, uh, civil actions against. Anybody, you know? Mm-hmm. Even if it has nothing to do with abortion, uh, but that they, they, it’s just, uh, it’s a very different dynamic here in our state.

Andrew Shirvell: So that’s why you have to know all the different players. And, uh, [00:40:00] if you go back to 2021, when Representative Webster Barnaby introduced the, the first version of the Florida Heartbeat Law. It was mirrored on Texas’s novel legislation, and that allowed, as I said, uh, private rights of action against a third party civil remedies rather than criminal remedies.

Andrew Shirvell: But it was opposed by DeSantis allies in the state Senate, most notably the incoming. Senate President Kathleen Omo, who equated it with, uh, basically, um, uh, you know, what they did in Nazi Germany, which was telling on neighbors and stuff, which was absolutely offensive. And don’t worry, I called for her not to be Senate president because I knew she wouldn’t be good.

Andrew Shirvell: And of course, she just voted right now on November 4th, once again, against this civil liability for the wrongful death of unborn child legislation because she is opposed to this, this overall. Right of people to sue, uh, you know, uh, and expand the right to sue. [00:41:00] Whether it has to do with abortion or not, Andrew, it’s just a philosophical difference.

Bruce Cherry: Andrew, let me jump in there real quick. We’ve got another break coming up and we’ll come right back ’cause I want to talk more about this person and wanna make sure that everybody knows her name so that uh, next time she’s up for reelection, we can get her outta that job. We can help her seek a new career.

Bruce Cherry: How about that? We’ll come back with more Pro-Life Radio. We’re coming to you from the John Barrows Memorial Studio on a Sunday night. Andrew Cheval from Florida. Voice for the Unborn is our guest, and we’ll be right back on AM nine 50 FM 94.9. The answer

Vicky Cherry: wasn’t there. Great hope for her. And then she kind of started. Doing this kind of thing, Andrew?

Andrew Shirvell: Yeah. You know, I mean, she had been pro-abortion in her earlier career. Then she, she had a [00:42:00] conversion when she wanted to run to become senate president.

Group: Yeah.

Andrew Shirvell: And uh, that’s be pulled the wool over the lot. Yeah.

Andrew Shirvell: Yes. Okay. So Andrew, hold It was very swampy. Hold onto that thought because

Bruce Cherry: when we come back I want Vicky to ask you that exact same question and I’d like for you to answer it the exact same way. Sure. Some of the best radio takes place during the commercial breaks, so just the way it is. Pete, when you’re ready.

Bruce Cherry: We’re ready. Ready? 3, 2, 1.

Vicky Cherry: And welcome back to Pro-Life Radio. I’m Vicky Cherry. Across from me is my handsome husband, Bruce. Hey. Hey, online with, this is Andrew from Florida’s voice for the Unborn. So Andrew, before we went to break, we were talking about, um,

Bruce Cherry: Kathleen Pomo,

Vicky Cherry: PAs Domo. And I had asked, I, during the break, I asked you the question ’cause I remember a while back.

Vicky Cherry: She was hopeful that we, we were thinking she would [00:43:00] be really good for the pro-life side. Um, what happened with that?

Andrew Shirvell: Well, you know, Senator Omo, who is actually term limited out thankfully at the end of uh, 2026, but she served as the Senate president from uh, 2022 through 2024, and so it was kind of odd that she still had two more years to go and she’s still in the chamber kind of causing us problems.

Andrew Shirvell: But earlier in her career, she had served in the State House and she was, um, a very friendly, um, if you wanna call it with the abortion industry pro-choice. Mm. Um, what we would call pro-abortion. She kind of had a set sudden metamorphosis when she entered the, the state Senate. And, uh, she wanted to had, uh, you know, an ambition to become the Senate president.

Andrew Shirvell: And in Florida, they pick our legislative leaders, strangely enough. Many years before they actually start serving their term as legislative leader. That’s a conversation for a whole nother day. ’cause it creates so many different [00:44:00] headaches. But she, she kind of, I think, pulled the wool over a lot of people’s eyes by saying she had had a conversion to being pro-life and she would be pro-life.

Andrew Shirvell: Uh, I don’t think she foresaw when she, she, uh, ran, uh, for Senate president that that would be the year that when she took over as Senate president, that was the year that Roe versus Wade was overturned, uh, by the US Supreme Court and it was a total watershed. And now the legislature had the ability, if it wanted to, to, you know, um, pass a complete abortion ban where they really didn’t have that ability before.

Andrew Shirvell: So, uh, in the anticipation of that, in 2021. She, you know, as I said, representative Webster Barnaby in the State House had proposed and filed legislation that was modeled on Texas’s novel Heartbeat Law that would allow, you know, individuals to sue, not the woman that has had an abortion, but those cooperating in an abortion like an abortionist, [00:45:00] uh, uh, for participating in this.

Andrew Shirvell: Um, and, and, and kind of acting as a deterrent with civil remedies, uh, that can kind of explore those issues in civil court. Um, but she was opposed to it. Senator Omo was opposed to it, and she, she actually, uh, likened it to what. Was going on in Nazi Germany. I thought it was a completely crazy analogy that had no, no, um, basis in reality.

Andrew Shirvell: I did send a letter to all her colleagues in October of 2021 saying, please don’t officially elect this, um, senator as your new president starting in 2022. So I don’t think that actually endeared me so well to her. But, uh, I have met with her staff. I did meet with her staff subsequently, and we, you know, we tried as best we could to work with her.

Andrew Shirvell: And, um, you know, she, she, we had to twist a lot of arms and, and really due to the Lord’s, uh, plan, she did finally go along with the Heartbeat law. But she, she’s always been somebody who’s in a powerful position. She’s right now [00:46:00] the, the chairperson of the rules committee in the Senate. And for the last two sessions, she killed.

Andrew Shirvell: The civil liability for the wrongful death of an unborn child legislation in the Senate. ’cause she refused to bring the bill in her committee. So she, she wield, um, tremendous influence and tremendous power. Uh, that’s why I’m looking forward to her actually leaving the legislature. She’s from a very conservative, uh, district in Naples and you wouldn’t think, um, you know, she’d be like that.

Andrew Shirvell: Uh, but, uh, you know, the problem here in Florida is that we really haven’t. Held our legislators account politically in a way that they should be. Mm-hmm. Um, and that, that has to do with the variety of factors. Of course. Uh, funding is a big thing. Uh, you know, these politicians raise oodles amounts of money and they can really pull the wool over the eyes of voters with all sorts of slick advertising and mailers.

Andrew Shirvell: And us little pro-lifers, you know, we can do what we can. But we’re, we’re gonna try to transform that landscape going [00:47:00] forward in 2026 because Florida Voice for the unborn is poised to be filing our first political, um, committee, political action committee. I guess that’s more commonly referred to in the, in the vernacular, but that will actually make endorsements of legislators for the first time, and also talk more about their record on life issues because we have to let.

Andrew Shirvell: Voters know mm-hmm. What their actual votes are, because that’s the only way we’re gonna enact change. And we have to do it in a smart, strategic fashion. We can’t be going after people that are sure best to be in back in the legislature. We have to pick and choose our battles a little more wisely and go in there where we can make a difference in a close race.

Andrew Shirvell: And I, I, I hate to use this term, but teach them a lesson. That’s what we gotta do. Mm-hmm. We gotta teach a lesson that we mean business. And that, that, you know, the only thing I, I co I understand that politicians care about I, and this is a little cynical, is that they, they care about being elected or [00:48:00] reelected.

Andrew Shirvell: That’s their first priority. Yeah. Right? Yeah. The other stuff is kind of secondary,

Group: right? We always, so we have to kind

Andrew Shirvell: of bring it front and center to them that the life of unborn children should be on their top. Issues page all the time and should be, uh, first and foremost in their thoughts and kind of doing what they’ve been doing for many years pre the fall of Roe versus Wade, which is, you know, blame other people or shove it off onto somebody else’s responsibility is not gonna fly anymore in a do.

Andrew Shirvell: Era world where they actually have the power Tomorrow, if they wanted to, they could convene a special session and they could pass a law that closes every single abortion mill, uh, in Florida. And Governor DeSantis could sign that bill into law that night, and that would be the law of the land. And it’s perfectly legal under, uh, the Dobbs decision federally, and it’s perfectly legal under our new Florida Supreme Court decision that came out on April 1st.

Andrew Shirvell: That allow, says there’s no right to abortion. Under our state’s constitution. So they [00:49:00] could do it tomorrow. They could, but the the problem is, uh, or the question is, do they have the political will to do it? And that’s what we as a grassroots pro-life movement need to answer for them. We have to push it on them.

Andrew Shirvell: Uh, because if we don’t push, they’re not gonna go ahead and do it. They just won’t.

Vicky Cherry: And we were just talking about that. That does. Do they have that power? And I know some people, they say, well, I’m a lawyer and I don’t think that anybody has that power. And then some people say they do so,

Bruce Cherry: but he’s there.

Bruce Cherry: You have

Vicky Cherry: it.

Bruce Cherry: Andrew’s a lawyer and he knows they, yeah, they do have it. And, and, and we’ve been told this by lawyers who, again, battle cases before the United States Supreme Court, we know them and they, they, they take cases to the Supreme Court. They win those cases and they know the limitations of. Of power that our elected officials have, and they, they know what they can do.

Bruce Cherry: And so I, I submit, and I know I’m going out on a limb here, and this is my opinion, this has nothing to do with the radio station. This has nothing to do with [00:50:00] Vicky. This is me. This is my opinion. There’s my disclaimer, and I’m not even saying that Andrew, uh, believes this. My feeling is when you’ve got a lot of people who claim to be Christian, who claim to be conservative, who claim to be pro-life, but they won’t support.

Bruce Cherry: Ending abortion in our community. Mm-hmm. There’s a reason it’s either financial for them or maybe just maybe they participated in an abortion. Maybe they had one. Maybe they had somebody or induced someone to have one, or a daughter or a girlfriend, or maybe, maybe they, the elected official themselves had an abortion at some point.

Bruce Cherry: There’s something in their background that says they’re not willing to go out on a limb to protect the unborn. That’s my feeling. And I, [00:51:00] I, I, that’s the only way I can wrap my mind around understanding why they won’t say, let’s end abortion.

Group: Mm-hmm.

Bruce Cherry: It’s, it’s not a woman’s right thing. It’s not a, my body, my choice thing.

Bruce Cherry: I think it’s, it’s, I think it’s something deeper than that. That’s just me.

Vicky Cherry: Andrew, I asked you earlier if, um, you had some tips for us, what you think are some of the most effective ways to abolish abortion? We have about three minutes. Yes. Uh,

Andrew Shirvell: Vicky, and, and that’s what I wanna leave your listeners, uh, with because there is so much we as ordinary, um, advocates for the unborn can do.

Andrew Shirvell: Uh, to move our, uh, culture in the right direction, uh, regardless of when or when our legislature or elected officials, um, do the right thing. Mm-hmm. And, and, and end abortion in our state and in our country and in the world because it’s a huge global problem. Uh, but there’s so much we can individually do.

Andrew Shirvell: Uh, first thing [00:52:00] is that we can’t ignore the issue. Uh, and, and, and also we can’t be, um, I don’t want to say, uh, we can’t live and breathe the issue 24 7 because that is something actually that I do. Um, but I know that, that this is a specific subset of people, but we have to be, we have to be at the forefront of, of, uh, advocating.

Andrew Shirvell: We can’t be afraid. So that means going to our pastor, uh, at, at the, uh, at the church that we attend and saying, look, I know this is a difficult issue. But I really feel there’s a lot of hurt out there. There’s a lot of misunderstanding and we, we wanna prevent not only other women from experiencing this pain of abortion, but that, you know, relieving and, and saving these children from such a horrible fate.

Andrew Shirvell: And even if we just save one child because. The pastor stood up and said, this is wrong. Then we’ve, we’ve done our duty. But that, that’s, that’s something practical I think every single Christian can do is go to their pastor and if the pastor says, well, I don’t, you, [00:53:00] you help them outright the sermon, you help you do whatever is necessary to get them.

Andrew Shirvell: As fervent, uh, a believer as you are in the cause. Um, that’s the only way we do it one-on-one. And I know it takes time and I know it can be sometimes demoralizing when we don’t get the response that we think we should, but God doesn’t give up on people, so neither should we. We, we have a duty to, to, to evangelize not only.

Andrew Shirvell: With the lifesaving, um, uh, of message of the gospel, but also with the lifesaving message, uh, uh, of, of, of you will the, the Gospel of life that says that, uh, you know, all unborn children are created in the image, uh, of, of God Almighty from the moment of conception and. As a society, have a duty to protect

Group: them.

Andrew Shirvell: Just like we would have a duty to protect a born child or adult, or individual, uh, at any stage of development, uh, from being, um, unjustly [00:54:00] killed. So that, that is, that is our duty and, and we have to really recognize it internally ourselves. It’s not for somebody else to do, it’s for us. Amen.

Bruce Cherry: Absolutely.

Bruce Cherry: Andrew, thank you so much for joining us tonight. We are at the end of the show. It goes quick.

Vicky Cherry: It does.

Bruce Cherry: It goes so quick. Andrew Vel especially. I love

Vicky Cherry: having Andrew on because he has so much information. He’s just

Bruce Cherry: a wealth of information. Andrew Shirvell, founder and director of the Florida Voice for the Unborn.

Bruce Cherry: They need your support. Visit their website at Florida. Voice for the unborn.com. That’s Florida voice for the unborn.com. We’ll put a link on our website as well, which is pro life radio.com. Thank you for joining us. Coming to you from the John Barrows Memorial Studio. Thanks to Pete Piquette, our producer.

Bruce Cherry: Thank you to my lovely wife, Vicky. Thank you. For joining us tonight, I’m Bruce Cherry Goodnight. We will see you again next week. On AM nine 50 FM 94.9, the [00:55:00] answer.